Why AD's in a paid application for android OS ?

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:33 am

Support will not reply back to me so I post here.

Why did you turn a game that was AD free into a AD platform for you company ?

It would not be such a pain if it were only a banner but you pop the AD up at start every time.

Now for comic books......seriously ?!?

I have bought every single Carmageddon game ever made but Reincarnation will not be one, why did you feel a need to remind us each and every time we start the game when you know you have a very loyal and cult like following???

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 11:49 pm

No comments at all, seriously ?

Espyo · Post by **Espyo** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 8:23 am

I've only tried Carma Free (I just got the tablet, I'll buy the real deal soon!), and I haven't seen any ads yet. Are you getting the ads for the full version of the game? And are you sure those ads are the money-grabbing kind, and not just gentle ads for the franchise's own free comic book?

Trent · Post by **Trent** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 9:36 am

They're not turning it into an advertising platform for the company, they're using it to bring the latest Carmageddon related news to people who play the mobile version but don't follow Reincarnation's development or come to the website. Stainless definitely have a very loyal cult following, but that's not who those news flashes are aimed at. The mobile game is played by a large number of people who had never heard of Carmageddon before and aren't part of that loyal fanbase. The aim of telling gamers playing the mobile version what's new in the world of Carmageddon is to bring those gamers to the website and turn them from "people who play the mobile game" into actual fans of the franchise. I can guarantee a large portion of the mobile gamers didn't know there's a official free online comic being made which can be read on here on the website so putting the news flash about it in the mobile game is a good way to let people know. Did you know about it before hand? The way you're outraged about them advertising "comic books" suggests not.

It's nothing to be getting upset about, it's not like they're filling the game with tons of generic money-making ads for random apps between each race like so many other mobile games do, ratjer they're only informing players of the latest Carmageddon news when the game starts. I haven't even seen them advertise their other games (such as Magic 2015) on their either, it's only showing things relevant to Carmageddon. The more people who become actual fans of the series instead of just playing the one mobile game, the better it is for everyone, why get angry about them trying to expand that fanbase? And surely deciding to boycott Reincarnation over something as petty as these insignificant newsflashes means you're not really part of that loyal and cult like following which you point out don't need these newsflashes?

TwIsTeDMiNd · Post by **TwIsTeDMiNd** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:48 am

Damn you! You have to lower your finger down on a screen one time at the start of a game just like any game would ask you with a start button. The ad is suggesting you to read a free comic made by a community member for the community. Stainless don't even do money benefit on it. It's just for you they're making it. And now you're upset and don't want to buy their games anymore because of that and you're heavy finger? Life must be hard on your side. What a beautiful way to create an account and present you on a forum.

Toshiba-3 · Post by **Toshiba-3** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:41 pm

Haha! ...is this a joke?

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 2:07 pm

Well the add is not a start button, it is a interruption on the way to the start button. And why do I need to see it ever single time the game is run ?

No it is not a joke, now it is one AD, it is the principle of it, it was a paid application. I would not be surprised to see two AD's at some point, and what makes me most mad was long before I changed my review to one star I emailed the folks at this company sever times to ask why if the (Reincarnation) AD was going to be permanent or would it at least go away when the game went retail, and they never bothered to reply.

A simple reply would have been nice but they could not bother, and as far as comic books go I do not care about that in the least bit so why do I need to (click past it) every single time I want to play. My question was do you really think we forget from the last time we ran the game or are you just making sure we got it. What would have been wrong with the AD just once or at least a option to not see it again if (had to lower our finger) to check off the box that said (I got it, yea yea a comic book, thanks for the info)

The only one star reviews are from people like me irate at the AD's, kinda stupid on their part to not want a five star game across the board but they are just going with the majority and thinking who cares.

I have better things to spend my money on then AD platforms for a company, and YES it is a AD platform when they advertise other products they sell, especially non software ones.

I bought ever game these people ever made, but will not bother with Reincarnation, wonder what type of AD's will be in that game after it goes retail. AD's that are not a start button but a button to delay you on to the game.

Oh and the ONLY reason I created this account and this forum post is due to the fact these people would not respond at all to civil and at the time mellow emails.

HEX1GON · Post by **HEX1GON** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 3:23 pm

Oh the horror..

FatCat · Post by **FatCat** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 4:13 pm

Doctorwhyowhy wrote:*rant*

Go see the god damn comic. Maybe then you'll understand why they advertised a FREE thing. Czechdeath is an extremely talented artist and he deserves all the praise he gets. If you're unhappy with that, you can uninstall Carma iOS and stop posting ignorant bait.

You rated the game 1 star for having an ad about something you can go see for free, which was made FOR the community? You are trully a horrible person.

KakkaHousu · Post by **KakkaHousu** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 4:17 pm

And if you are too lazy to click Media\Carmageddon official comic on site's upper edge here is link: http://www.carmageddon.com/sites/default/files/comic/eng/ep1/forum.html

Russian version:
http://www.carmageddon.com/sites/default/files/comic/rus/ep1/forum.html

Espyo · Post by **Espyo** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 4:28 pm

Uh huh. People rate the game 1 star solely because of an "ad", sure. And you're one of the "loyal fans", but can't even follow the forums to the point of understanding the tremendous amount of work Stainless is swamped in, to the point where they can't afford to reply to pointless e-mails.

I get it, you were just mad because you stepped on a pebble barefoot or something. It's all right, it happens to all of us. Just drink it off, get some rest, come back tomorrow, and we'll see how it goes from there.

TwIsTeDMiNd · Post by **TwIsTeDMiNd** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 4:29 pm

Oh, what a rancorous way of thinking!! So you're bashing the entire game by giving it 1 star just because you're angry about the ad? What a great way of making a review...thank you!! And thinking a PC game like Reincarnation would get same sort of treatment (ads-related) as a mobile game is pure ignorance. You really should throw your hate somewhere else.

Errol · Post by **Errol** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 4:34 pm

I doubt you'll be back and I highly doubt anything anyone says will make the blindest bit of difference to you but I'm used to wasting my time.

DrWhyOhWhy wrote:I have better things to spend my money on then AD platforms for a company, and YES it is a AD platform when they advertise other products they sell, especially non software ones.

Apart from the fact it is not a product and they're not selling it. Is it still an AD platform if they're not advertising other products they sell?

DrWhyOhWhy wrote:why do I need to (click past it) every single time I want to play

I totally agree with you here. Poor UI design is poor. It should only show once and be more clearly marked as a link to a free web-comic.

DrWhyOhWhy wrote:I emailed the folks at this company sever times to ask why if the (Reincarnation) AD was going to be permanent or would it at least go away when the game went retail, and they never bothered to reply.

This seems to be the crux of the matter. You were snubbed by whomever you emailed and you wanted to lash out in some way in retaliation. Poor show, chap. I emailed Pendleton Ward and asked him to design me a tattoo and he never replied. I don't now go around rating all his works one star.

I've been trying to think of a nice way to end this post for a little while now. A single phrase keeps popping into my head over and over so I'll finish with that...

Grow up.

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 10:49 pm

For the longest time the AD was not for a comic but for Reincarnation, is that free no it is not.

All I stated was my opinion and what I said is called ignorant bait ? Sounds like you are more on the defensive them I.

As far as the company not bothering to reply to my email, my first email to them only asked if they were going to go further with the AD's and if in the future I should expect to see Max Bobble heads or key chains or other such garbage. This was all done in a humorous tone and as I stated at the time my review was still five star.

Lack of a reply to a paying customer who has supported them in the form of buying every piece of software they made since he saw countries were banning them unfairly was rude.

So the one star was not initially for something that was free, what AD will be next...time will tell.

TwIsTeDMiNd · Post by **TwIsTeDMiNd** » Fri Sep 05, 2014 12:23 am

Man, can you just admit there is bigger problem than this in life?! Seriously. Bang. Right Now. I want to hear it, no joking at all. It's awful how people sometimes can get upset for nothing. Who minds clicking on a button while after that you can enjoy the damn game for 2 hours if you want!! And even 5 hours in a row if you want...and this without any advertising. Doesn't we live in a beautiful world? Doesn't it? What is even more great is that if you turn your WiFi down you will not even get to see the advertising your worried about anymore. Now if you tell me angels don't exist I will puke on myself. Angels DO exist! I agree it would be nice to have a don't remind me button but it's not small details like that that could stop me from buying a game I like. Otherwise you miss something really great, but it's your problem Buddy. Stainless haven't replied you because they're busy working on Reincarnation. I don't think Stainless would not have replied to you on purpose. They are great guys. They're just too busy, so don't take it personnal. :)

Btw, Reincarnation is a crowd-funded game. This is why they're advertising it, because they have no publisher. Anyone owning a game company would do the same, me first. These guys have families too! Stainless is an indie developer and needs support to grow the license back. Apart from making a CGI trailer (which cost money) or with social medias, interviews and steam, there is not much any other way they can advertise it. Just a friendly advice...show everyone you can understand something as simple as this and you will be much more welcome and appreciated. I guarantee you! I can understand you was not aware of that but sometimes, doing small research before posting can do all the difference in the way people perceive you.

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:48 am

Maybe instead of being such a harsh critic and in general rude to someone who just voiced a opinion you should invest some time in your ability to speak and not sound like an angry troll yourself. Speaking of trolls, what exactly (I am not going to google it) is a copyright troll ? As far as I know Carmageddon was the first and only to this date game of its type.

And no, I do not have any interest in buying a version of Reincarnation.

As far as Angels go, well that is a matter of personal opinion. Some believe in the invisible dragon that lives in their garage that cannot be seen felt or heard. I myself am Agnostic and not sure what to believe other then religion causes more and more bloody wars then any other topic. Yes I was and still am a little angry at the lack of a reply as I did send five polite one, scratch that four polite ones filled with minor humor and compiments. To still not hear back is rather unthinking no matter how busy they are.

I can say I am at least somewhat thankful that a few of you agree on some level that the GUI and the persistent AD could have been avoided and that was one of my points in the email to them. All I was looking for at that time was a simple reply (We will look into it and consider what you and others have said) but instead silence. It is too easy for me to be given the impression that they just do not care.

And yes there sure are bigger problems in life, but they are addressed in other ways other then a simple typed message. I considered this a laste ditch attempt to get a response from the company to hear what they had to say, again nothing.

If you have the time I would like to have illumination on the copy right troll thing as I am rather curious.

Also as far as puking on yourself I would give that second thoughts, when I turned 21 a couple decades ago I had the brilliant idea to buy a twelve pack of Pabst Blue Ribbon and wash it down with a pint of Jack D, a four pack of California coolers (do they make them anymore?) and topped it off with some homemade (poorly made) Moonshine, when I awoke the next day I found I had puked in my sleep in the tent fountain style and the pocket of my flannel shirt was full of very poorly scared food from a few hours before. Needless to say I do not mix booze to the extreme these days but I never forgot the look on my two friends faces as I exited the tent, one had part of a pickle stuck in his hair and the other was washing up a little in the river we camped near.

I only tell the story to try and show you I do have a little humor left in me and that my only intention was to try and get a response from this company not to get the ire and resentment from people for telling things the way I feel. I never asked anyone to side with me, I did not expect it I just wanted to vent in hopes of some reply for the people that made one of the best games ever.

And yes my stubborn principles will keep me away from Reincarnation and any other future products should they fail to reply to me, a choice that affects me and no other. Unless you think opinions like myself and a few others about the issue could possible affect you, and I do not see how that is possible.

I am a stubborn person and have my opinions just as you all do, I doubt any of us will change. Unless this forum does not permit it why not share with me (us) a story from your past that may lighten the mood, not sure I even accomplished that but any way have fun and enjoy life the way you want and I will do the same.

Errol · Post by **Errol** » Fri Sep 05, 2014 9:42 am

I must apologise somewhat; I didn't realise this wasn't the first ad. I probably shouldn't have joined in the discussion without all the facts.

I still think the one star review is petty, especially as all you were expecting back from them was some placating but hollow words. Personally I'd rather receive nothing at all than a canned response. Each to their own.

I too am a pretty stubborn individual and have missed out on some excellent things over the years because I've drawn a line for some daft reason and have refused to cross it. If this is your line and C:R falls on the other side of it then that's your choice but I assure you that if you like Carmageddon then you'll like C:R and you're doing yourself a disservice.

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Fri Sep 05, 2014 10:06 am

You are correct, a one star review is petty. But when the company will not even knowledge my question I feel the need to push back.

There are over 300 one star reviews and the majority of them are people mad at AD's. some are people saying the graphics are crap and I would tend to think those people are CGI spoiled who did not grow up with 8 bit computers to play games on, maybe it is because my eyesight is not so good but I think Carmageddon for the android looks great. So on that note I can understand your opinion of my actions.

I was in a video store once listening to some very young (collage students) talking about Star Wars and saying it was a piece of garbage with poor special effects and lousy acting, I have to laugh and think to myself they are crazy but that does not invalidate their opinions or mine.

I personally think AD's for all things thee days are getting out of control, you want to watch a trailer for a movie and what happens, you get a commercial to watch a commercial. This may make me sound like a old timer who says (Back in my day we had this) I dunno.

I just see the AD's for a (free) comic and think to myself, will that be the only issue printed, will there be a non free series following. It is all kind a complicated. If you have not figured it out I am a cynic, not a good trait but part of my nature. Yes if I refuse to buy Reincarnation I may lose out on a great game but maybe I will go fishing instead and make a different set of cherished memories. When me and a very old friend still hang out and drink ourselves silly on a long weekend that snoring lazy sleepy dude still wakes up with a half eaten pickle on his head as a joke and reminder. You would think after 20 years I would not think it funny but I do.

Anyway a hollow response, even a generic (sorry your unhappy) would have been something, such a shame so many poor reviews for such a simple thing to fix. And when a company starts to not care or listen to the people that buys from them I lose interest in supporting them. Think of it, over 300 people and one star again I dunno but thank you for the reply.

TwIsTeDMiNd · Post by **TwIsTeDMiNd** » Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:24 pm

Stainless staff do respond to certain questions here on forum from time to time. Also, nobby and sim take 2 hours of their time each wednesday to answer all questions people have on the twitch streams. If it's not dedication I don't know what it is! It's really just a matter of time before they see your topic here. But you still continue to emphasize on how much you feel stabbed in the back as a customer no matter what we try to tell you. Honestly, I felt kinda rude a little at first when I had read up my comment again and I apologize. I thought you was a troll but I readed all your posts again and found out I was wrong, so If you notice, I edited my post before you replied me back. Maybe you should read it again. Thanks for telling me I have inability to speak but if you read up again, my post was humoristic as well. If everyone here looked like they were on the offensive, there is a reason for it. The AD thing you are worried about is probably very insignificant for the majority of us which led people here to think you was trolling plus you said you were not interested to buy the game because of that. Also, It's frustrating seeing an ignorant person come here and supposing things against a developer without having any idea in the first place. You can be ignorant, but your lack and/or your inability to research on the matter doesn't justify being angry and supposing things against a developer or a person for nothing. Only person you should blame is you but I'm not here to tell you what to do.

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Fri Sep 05, 2014 10:57 pm

You never told me what copyright troll is so I went and did the wiki/google thing. and to be honest I would have to say I am the opposite in the extreme.

I look at most books, music and art especially as something that should be revered and not copyrighted to death. I understand the people that make these creations deserve to be paid no question there but I utterly HATE when big dipstick organizations like the RIAA and such think they should be hard at work to cash in on someones creation made half a century ago. When they bitch pissed and moaned to get copyright laws extended it is not easy to figure out it was not to help the original artist but to fill the already full pockets of the leeches who ride on the shirt tails of the real artists like a parasite.

I do not believe in full blown piracy but I do believe the model to which we use to sell products of the media nature needs some serious rethinking.

So no, if I understand right I am far from a copyright troll. I think those pricks should be the first against the wall when the revolution comes.

You can call me ignorant, I am as thick skinned as I am thick skulled but please also add paranoid, when I see a free comic I can only wonder when it will turn into a ongoing series with a cover price. Maybe never, you choose to be more positive minded and I choose to be cynical and look for the worst. To each their own.

I have a shelf full of comic books, nothing modern I think my newest titles are The Badger, a series if you have not read you should do so as it is good stuff. Again maybe it is the old fart in me talking but I do not think you get your moneys worth today from that industry. And yet again I must emphasize I understand the (AD) for the comics is a FREE comic, no ignorance there. Just the stubbornness of who cares, I had known about that before I saw the damn splash screen on carmageddon android. and before you load both barrels and let me have it I am sure the artist if fine, great even but to be honest as much as I love comic books free or not I do not want to see the AD/splash screen every time. It seems desperate and Stainless steel games does NOT need to be desperate.

I still stand my stubborn and ignorant ground if you will of personally not wanting to buy/look at Reincarnation till I see where things go. So far from what I see it will be their first product I do not buy or play. Truth be told I am such a stubborn jackass I will remember this 20 years from now and if I saw reincarnation in the bargain bin at the store would pass it by, unless of course things change.

I neither want your love or hate, I just came here to vent in hopes the folks with the power would at least consider getting their 300+ one star reviews back to their deserved five stars. And yes we are all petty us AD haters that one star review, but so are the people who one star it claiming the graphics are crap.

I played carmageddon android last night for a couple hours but sadly I still have the mental block of anger and I know it will not go away without acknowledgement of some type. If the folks at stainless said to me, screw those people that gave one star reviews we do not give a care it would at least show that they have opinions and are not hiding but staying back and not answering emails with o many angry people out there makes them look timid and I never thought of this company as timid.

On a side note we had a Demolition derby here in my town a few weeks back and in one of the fights in the middle heavy class was a Station Wagon driven by a guy named Hunter and he doctored up his car to look as much like Hunter from the game a really good job car was a remarkable piece of demolition Cosplay and to let you know HE WON !

That demo derby is what made me reload my android game and try it again and that is when I saw the AD (splash screen) for the free comic.

By the way this dude Hunter let a a YEEHAW at the start of the fight that would make any redneck proud.

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 4:27 pm

BUMP -cough-

Sorry for that, did not want this message thing to die down just yet, I really hope to get some limited reply from the folks at Stainless.

You know my previous post about the demo derby made me think of copyright trolls, if I understand things right a true copyright troll would have been in the face of the person who called themselves Hunter and entered a car that looked remarkably like the one in Carmageddon.

One of my biggest reason for being such a pisspot over comics would be the (trolls) at Marvel/DC comics. If they had their way they would charge us for our kids playing Batman and Joker in the backyard, Indie comics are good stuff. I must reiterate that the Series The Badger is a very very good read. Though I am not sure that comic company could be considered indy anymore.

BUMP -couch-

shane · Post by **shane** » Sat Sep 13, 2014 2:05 pm

Apologies for not getting a response out to you earlier and sorry to hear your unhappy with the ads showing in the app. We see the ads showing up in our mobile apps as promoting other Carmageddon related things of interest and events that our Carma community would be interested in and this is the only thing it will show (apart from rare marketing opportunities that help us get Carmageddon into more hands!).

We are looking at what we can do to decrease the frequency that these appear as we are aware it can be a little frustrating it popping up every time but we also hope that it helps let our audience know what's happening in the Carma Universe for those who don't frequently visit carmageddon.com much - like promoting our comic and future Twitch broadcasts.

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Sun Sep 14, 2014 9:38 am

Since my last post here I have sent three emails to Stainless and received the automated reply that it was being brought to the attention of the customer care staff but I have yet to receive a email other then automated.

As far as reducing the frequency, how about ONE time per (event) I am sure you do not think we users actually forget and need to be reminded each and every single time. To be honest here I would not mind if there was a (I need to click past) pop up each and every single damn time if at least it was something different and not the same damn thing over and over. It is rather insulting.

Tell ya what, put a feature in the android app for the paid version of Carmageddon that turns that stuff off and not only do you get your five star review back but I will make the investment in Reincarnation.

You have a horrendous amount of negative reviews that would disappear if you did this.

Remember I did not pay for a game to have you get quote "Marketing opportunities" on my time. Hell I would have paid 10 bucks easy for the android app if it did not have any of that stuff in it.

Orc JMR · Post by **Orc JMR** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 12:29 pm

Ahahahah!

Seriously?

You notice a mobile game you paid for shows you an ad with above-desired frequency. You write how many emails already? Ten? Fifteen? You start a forum thread. You lose dozens, hundreds of times more time that you would ever save on this 2-3-second ad click-through. What do you gain, man?

What amuses me most of all is your attitude of a "paying customer". You demand developers to put features you want, and then you maaay come down and pay them your 25 bucks - oh the riches! No, 25 bucks won't pay for one hour of the programmer's work to write what you demand. They won't pay for testing, documenting and all kinds of activities that surround actual coding. The only way you can push throught the features you personally want is by proving they are wanted by many people, and will improve company's standings with those people. Which it great, because you have exactly that - "horrendous amount of negative reviews" to back your claim!

Can we please see them?

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 10:03 pm

Can you see the negative review ? What a stupid thing to say, yea you can see the reviews. Just look at the reviews in the google store for the paid version and click the show all button and then scroll down and find the one star reviews and see what the comments are. You will find that most are from anger at the AD's.

It is not hard to do, just requires time as you said. there are over 300 negative reviews. As far as time goes, I am retired and have plenty.

So go ahead piss and moan now how you do not have the time to pour over all the reviews. Most of the people who have posted reply's have called me all manner of names but the truth is most of them are very defensive and caustic themselves.

You want to see the proof go look for yourselves, as the people from Stainless could do. The community manager said it best Marketing opportunities, I did not pay for a game to have the same (Marketing opportunity) shown to me day in and day out. and those other reviews say the same things.

All I did when sending emails to them was ask them if it was worth all the negativity to have the AD's and yes I got mad when they never bothered to reply back. So I post my feeling and I am the bad guy, well I can deal with the inane chatter, and I do not give up easy.

Go look at the reviews yourself or shut yer pie hole -wink-

Freeride Forever · Post by **Freeride Forever** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 11:00 pm

Sounds like a douche to me. :/

Orc JMR · Post by **Orc JMR** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 2:07 am

there are over 300 negative reviews

You are lying.

There are "over 300" negative ratings, not reviews. A respectable man like you should know the difference.

Ok, I did go and scroll through English reviews on Play store. Filtered by newest, scrolled through 349 reviews to the middle of May (it looks like ads were introduced on May 31). Let's analyze.

25 reviews with 4 stars for: ads x2, no specific reason x13, can't find opponent repulsificator, UI criticism x2, no google integration, performance x3, no controller x2, not as good as before

8 reviews with 3 stars for: ads x3, opponents killing themselves, no gamepad, cars too slidey, update removed shortcut, install problems

5 reviews with 2 stars for: ads, no reason, IAPs, performance, freezes

12 reviews with 1 star for: ads x7, can't move to SD card, bugs, install problem x2, crashes.

I have to repeat my question - can you please point us to "horrendous amount of negative reviews"?

Because 13 is not exactly a horrendous amount.

Let us calculate some more.

There are 108 stars missing from perfect 1745 possible - a 93,8% rating based on latest reviews (95,7% total Play store rating).

There are 39 stars missing from perfect ratings due to ads - 2,23% of total rating or 36% of total missing rating.

Even by the most awfully wrong calculation - taking whole 359 of 1-star reviews and multiplying it by 36% - we get 130 people mad with ads. Against 19 thousand 5-star happy people. Among a couple hundred thousands of players.
As I said, you're in a hopeless minority.

People think you're a bad guy not because you "post your feelings", but because you lie, you crave attention and you cause trouble when you are not noticed - like kids do. And some old people no one likes.

By the way, who do you spell "ads" as "AD's"? Attention disorder's?

Please write back!

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 5:41 am

Ratings Reviews , Potatoe Potato....

Bottom line small minority or not many people are unhappy and it could be fixed simply, do you really see a need to have the same thing show to us every time we play the game ? If you do not mind then good for you, your probably the type of person that does not mind needing to watch a AD on you tube when the you tube link is to a movie trailer. Good for you. I personally think advertising is running rampant and out of control.

Stainless could be one of the few games that make the five star grade nut as you aw for yourself most of the negativity is stemming from the AD BS

Neither of us will change our opinions, at least I am just irate at not getting a reply from them and not on the defensive for a game company that by its lack of actions does not care.

Orc JMR · Post by **Orc JMR** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 7:19 am

Of course, who needs to use proper terms and stick to what they say :-) So, judging by how you maneuver around my questions, you do not have that horrendous data to back you up. That, unfortunately, leads to a slight suspicion that your emails also contain over-the-top accusations and not-completely-true facts. Just sayin.

To correct your assumptions: I am the type of person who uses AdBlock and is sincerely shocked every rare time I have to venture into internet unshielded. It is just I do not like to be upset, so I ain't.

The difference between us is that I see both sides of the coin, and you sound as if you don't. See - advertising is bad, right? Right. I completely agree with you. Why is it bad? Because it forces you to lose time (let's assume all ads are worthless and we never buy or gain anything from them). So you fight. But there's a logical fallacy - ads are not worthless. They seem purely bad for this very specific you, but they bring value to their owner, and they bring value to people who learn about stuff from them. Advertising Carmageddon universe brings value to Stainless. It brings value even to those players who already know everything - more people buy games, more support the game would receive. Sure, players' value is very small, comparable to discomfort from seeing ads. But Stainless gains from it, and the amount they gain is easily quantifiable - they see traffic to comics and search interest for Reincarnation.

It is fine that you report the feature you don't like. But it is also fine that developers ignore your request, if you represent the minority. It is also fine, albeit upsetting, that they don't reply to you personally - they have thousands of people against them. It is not fine to bash and raise hell if you get ignored. You're not exactly the Queen, and you're not exactly paying for the project.

You're probably right that we're not going to change opinions on who owes whom a reply and 25 bucks. I'll leave you to your crusade, then.

Good luck!

(I'm still reading, if you want to reply.)

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 8:40 am

You are correct, my syntax was all wrong. As far as being ignored, yea it bothered me quite a bit especially since any reply other then the automated (we received your email and our customer service staff is reviewing it.

I know not how to prove I have received that same above message from them each and every email I sent. Forward them to someone ? No I am sure someone would say I just fabricated that as well. The people at Stainless decided their fate when they failed to reply to any of those emails, when a company does not bother to respond to a concern they are nailing the lid on their own coffin. Bigger companies out there get many more emails then these folks, yet they rely.The best these folks could do was send a email confining they received it and offer a false promise to contact me after their staff has looked it over.

I have been told I will only be hurting myself if I did not buy this newest game, on that point from a previous poster I disagree. My minority of people who do not like some things and choose to personally boycott a company and their products has generated insane amounts of anger and further strengthened my resolve.

I am sure you will agree there is no way I can prove my emails were sent and even if I could prove that it would not matter. I was and continue to be told that Stainless is too busy and cannot bother to reply back on such a question (opinions of multiple posters). And even then if I did indeed prove they ignore people i would be told I am a minority. Such anger and frustration from you posters when I say I will not buy or support a company like this when I am a mere minority.

As I have said, I do not wish to pay a company for a chance to hit me every time I play with a quote" marketing opportunity " much less a uncreative same thing every time type of deal.

Only a fool argues with a fool, and on that note I have done nothing but repeat myself over and over on these forums so my suggestion to you is not to bother with me anymore and I will just dry up and go away, and you folks can go back to what makes you happy and I can just find something better to do with my time then beat a dead horse.

Never push back against the machine however or whatever you view that machine as. For it you do you will be branded a liar, ignorant and be told above else that your opinion is not as valuable because you are a minority.

And be sure to remember it was a minority of people who supported Carmageddon back in the day when it was being banned. All that proves it that a minority can count from time to time.

The Garbarian · Post by **The Garbarian** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 10:40 am

Hey DoctorWhyo,

Before I add my 2 cents to this long thread, you are right we did add this to the game.

The reasons being that since we are an independent company and the people who play our game are essentially interested in our brand, this is the best way to reach out to them.

The problem is that there is not a lot of middleware out there that allows us to do that ourselves. They would all want us to join their ad rolodex and run horrible ads from other companies and so forth. I think I get 4 mails a day where somebody asks me to join their incredibly popular, amazingly cheap, fantastically rewarding ad blabla. We always refuse. I do not believe in giving ads in games, but what I do believe in, is that if I am playing Carmageddon, I am interested to know more about Carmageddon. As a cash strapped indie developer, the options to do this is limited.

You are right about the frequency, but Chartboost (what we use) does not allow a lower frequency. The one we had before (before APPLE BOUGHT IT!! GRRRRRRRR) allowed us to do it once a week and alternate stuff around and so forth. It was awesome and I guess Apple thought that too and bought them.

Now before I add an even longer post and such.

Two things, you are right about that it was no good to answer your requests for information. We have much to do and we have a very small department that takes care of it. This is my responsibility and I apologize.

Second, mail me directly at

and I can explain more about our decisions to run ads. Again, we are not really interested to make money out the ads (like all the others and we dont since we run only our social stuff) but what we want is to get people to love our brand more and show them what else we do. Like a comic, a new video, an update for C:R, even a free C1 on Steam ... etc). And the App is perfect for it.

Thanks for reading and looking forward to your mail,

J

Raan03 · Post by **Raan03** » Wed Sep 24, 2014 2:31 am

Just wondering, why not writing the last shown 'ad' 's date to a simple text file and if the time span of e. G. A week has elapsed, make the function call to show the ad... Or in this case make the function call to chartboost

Just wondering why something as simple and very basic like this isn't a viable alternative.

Doctorwhyowhy · Post by **Doctorwhyowhy** » Wed Sep 24, 2014 11:08 am

I would guess is is due to being lazy, greedy or they just do not give a tinkers damn about a minority of annoyed folks.

I would not be surprised if Chartboost has some rule to it's use that specifically says you cannot do that.

I was told in a email (yes finally got a response) that more AD's were on the way and that it was suggested I just not play the game rather then be annoyed, so I have taken that advise.

Raan03 your idea has merit, but I think there are nothing but deaf ears here and a company that is not what they were a long time ago.

MrHaaax · Post by **MrHaaax** » Wed Sep 24, 2014 3:37 pm

Getting warm and cozy in here, yes? Hell, it's actually getting hot.

Doctorwhyowhy, you'll have to cope with this. Indeed the design is bad; it should have a 'Never show this again' button, but there isn't any. But then again, it's not as annoying as third parties' ads. If you can't, then don't play the game. If you want to play the game but can't stand the ad, and already had submitted countless emails requesting to take the ad down, then don't play the game. Most importantly, stop bitching.

And people waited 17 long years for C:R, so they might be a little bit.. unstable. (Sorry!)

Errol · Post by **Errol** » Wed Sep 24, 2014 3:50 pm

Doctorwhyowhy, now you've had your response I'm just going to lock this thread before it descends further into bickering and name-calling. If you feel it should be reopened then please don't hesitate to drop me a PM.

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